Havoc
Posts:3
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| 24 Sep 2008 06:35:02 |
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hello, is anyone else concerned about the press release on Saturday regarding the new Cockers garden Centre at Newpark suddenly turning into a dobbies garden centre? I am concerned that this appears to be a 'back door application' to get a huge garden centre built on green belt land and that Cockers have misled everyone by saying that this was to be a Cockers garden centre.As Dobbies have / or are being taken over by Tesco does this mean we will in effect end up with a tesco store being built on green belt land?
Would be keen to hear other peoples views on this.
Thanks. |
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Bo888
Posts:1
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| 24 Sep 2008 07:32:17 |
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I would like to know about the access roads for customers, staff and suppliers and how it will impact the traffic on the Lang Stracht.
I also feel sorry for the people who live in the proximity of the new garden centre as it will completely change their idyllic situation and ruin their views. |
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Havoc
Posts:3
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| 24 Sep 2008 15:38:57 |
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| The proposal to build a Cocker's garden centre on Green Belt was already a matter of very serious concern and the proposal for a huge Dobbies instead is even more alarming. In their press release they say they will have "an indoor gift range including books, cards and stationery, toys and home fragrances, home accessories and perfumed body products and more." This Dobbies, which is after all under the Tesco umbrella, is going to be just another retail outlet - which will set a precedent for further retail outlets joining up Kingswells to Aberdeen. |
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Duthie
Posts:8
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| 25 Sep 2008 05:11:01 |
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| There are already traffic problems on the Lang Stracht in the morning and particularly in the afternoon when there is usually a tailback from the Kingswells roundabout all the way back to Springhill Road and it can take up to 40 minutes to get through. This is going to get significantly worse with the industrial estate developments along the B9119 where hundreds of jobs are going to be created. Do Dobbies really want to build on a site where their customers will be unable to get in or out for much of the afternoon; and are the Council really going to give planning permission for a development which will exacerbate the already increasing traffic problems on the Lang Stracht? |
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andy92
Posts:48
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| 27 Sep 2008 15:04:43 |
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The only difference I can see is that it will be cheaper, more choice and the food is really good. Gets my vote.
As for the traffic concerns, agree the Lang Stracht between 4 and 6pm heading out to Kingswells is not great. Better to avoid it and go out Queens Rd. The traffic flows a lot better and you dont get held up at the switchback r/about. |
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Duthie
Posts:8
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| 06 Oct 2008 07:49:31 |
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| Do you really think, Andy, that having one garden centre instead of two in competition will lead to cheaper prices and more choice? I'm sure the food will be really good but I'm sure it will be just as good if the garden centre is built on a developed site and not on green belt. |
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andy92
Posts:48
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| 07 Oct 2008 05:07:43 |
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| When speaking about competition, Dobbies are a national chain and will be far cheaper, example, Kingswells Coop and Asda. I dont have a problem with the proposed plans and site for the garden centre, at the end of the day, the majority of houses in Kingswells have been built on what was once greenbelt. A field is a field at the end of the day, its the gamble you take with being situated close to a city, I think its called progress :tongue: |
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Duthie
Posts:8
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| 07 Oct 2008 15:36:12 |
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| I'm not sure I get the point. Are you saying that a Dobbies on this site will be cheaper than the existing Dobbies? If not then what is the "cheaper" advantage you're arguing of having a Dobbies built on this site? If a field is a field then why do we have green belt, local plans, conservation areas, etc., etc.? Are you arguing for unrestricted building development without any kind of planning or overview? Again I'm sorry but I don't get the tongue bit? |
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andy92
Posts:48
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| 07 Oct 2008 19:35:56 |
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| Dobbies?? Cockers was mentioned in the first post, now i am confused. Duthie, surely you are not so naive to believe that land on the periphery of a city would not be built on one day. Green belt, local plans etc etc are just labels attached to pieces of land. Development within reason is the way ahead. You refer to the new development on the B9119, I agree there will be more traffic, however have to disagree that it will cause congestion on the Lang Stracht. The people who work there will be going against the flow of the commuter traffic. As an aside, were you the person that was complaining about the helicopters flying across Kingswells from the airport. |
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Duthie
Posts:8
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| 09 Oct 2008 06:55:25 |
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Andy, it says in the first post that the proposed Cockers has now become a proposed Dobbies. Did you not read it?
You write about "development within reason". Who decides what's within reason? Presumably we would need some kind of democratic process to decide where it's within reason to build and where it's within reason not to build and to produce plans, etc. of the decisions reached. These plans, etc. shouldn't be "just labels'. Developers, who will not unnaturally be trying to maximise their profits, may try to to cicumvent these plans if it is in their interests to do so but they should not be allowed to do so.
As for helicopters - firstly, I am not the person who complained about helicopters; and secondly, perhaps we should stick to the proposed Dobbies under this topic. |
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andy92
Posts:48
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| 09 Oct 2008 10:53:06 |
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| NIMBY springs to mind. As for increased traffic, not really much strength in that one. I think you have just got to accept that Kingswells will one day be part of Aberdeen. |
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Duthie
Posts:8
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| 12 Oct 2008 11:01:09 |
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NIMBY? Yes, guilty as charged. However that doesn't invalidate any of my arguments.
You're very good at trailing your coat, Andy, but not so good at following up on the issues you raise. Please try to explain to me what exactly you mean by "development within reason".
Also, I'm curious - if my motivation for entering this debate is NIMBYism, can you tell me what your motivation is? |
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andy92
Posts:48
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| 12 Oct 2008 14:38:39 |
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Development within reason I would suggest is exactly what it says. To me, a garden centre which will have minimum impact on the enviroment, will fit very well into the area and will be used by most of the community I think is reasonable. A factory that would be a blur on the landscape, with its added polution to me would not be reasonable. Just my view of course.
I have entered into this debate as I think its important to have at least a view, and best a say in the development of the local area.
I also have shares in Dobbies (joking). Duthie, are you fully against any development in the proposed area or have Dobbies sold you seeds that didnt turn into prize wining pumpkins :o))
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Duthie
Posts:8
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| 17 Oct 2008 10:12:10 |
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'Development within reason is exactly what it says.' Exactly??? This is such an inexact and undefined statement as be almost meaningless.
Just because a development is labelled a "garden centre" doesn't mean it will have minimum impact on the environment. This proposed "garden centre" will be a very large retail concern with a large restaurant and perhaps other related commercial activities too. It will bring with it a huge volume of traffic. It will in fact have a much bigger impact on the environment than many a small "factory".
Andy, you say that your motivation for pursuing this debate is that it is important to have a view. Isn't that being a bit disingenuous? Why this topic; why this view? We have a perfectly adequate existing Dobbies and we will soon have a superb Fox Lane on the B9119. You are arguing for moving the existing Dobbies about 1 mile closer to Kingswells onto Green Belt. I still don't understand your motivation for this argument? |
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andy92
Posts:48
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| 18 Oct 2008 12:48:58 |
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Couple of questions for you Duthie. Would you rather have a garden centre or an industrial premises/workshops that like many in Aberdeen run 24/7.
Its a bit of a contradiction to comment about the superb new centre on the B9119 when you have already stated that it will cause significant traffic problems, make up your mind. "Large restaurant" - bigger impact on the enviroment, still trying to work that one out.
To answer your point on motivation, I cannot see any harm in a development that would include a garden centre. I think I mentioned it before, we live on the outskirts of a major Scottish city which is getting bigger all the time. The more the population grows, the more services are required. Also, have you ever heard of the term, plain english? |
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andy92
Posts:48
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| 18 Oct 2008 12:51:15 |
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| Havoc, you started the post, any more views? |
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Duthie
Posts:8
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| 18 Oct 2008 13:59:40 |
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| A couple of questions for me! First of all how about you do me the courtesy of answering my questions? You're beginning to sound evasive. Why are you pursuing this debate? What's in this for you? |
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JB
Posts:5
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| 20 Oct 2008 08:22:13 |
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| I thought Cocker had already got planning permission to build a new garden centre on the site. |
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andy92
Posts:48
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| 20 Oct 2008 10:38:37 |
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[quote]Posted By JB on 20 Oct 2008 08:22:13
I thought Cocker had already got planning permission to build a new garden centre on the site.[/quote]
Excellent.
To answer your question Duthie, whats in it for me.
A national chain with excellent products and prices which I think will fit in well to the proposed site. Nothing more, nothing less.
And yourself? Are you views strong enough that you will not be a future customer?
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Duthie
Posts:8
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| 21 Oct 2008 13:52:12 |
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Andy, We seem to be going round in circles - you've already got your national chain which fits in well to its present site just about a mile further away from Kingswells. By the way, you're laying it on suspiciously thick with the "excellent products and prices"!
JB, I don't know if Mr. Cocker has already got planning permission for a Cocker's; and if he has, I don't know if Dobbies will need to reapply to build a Dobbies instead? Perhaps our Councillor could let us know? |
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