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andy92
Posts:48
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| 21 Jan 2008 16:02:46 |
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| Saw today where they are putting in a new crossing - right on the apex of the bend!!! Fifty yards further up or down the road would have made sense. Drivers who are heading down the road are blind to the fact that someone is crossing from the east? pavement. The council at its best again. |
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babsbaby
Posts:35
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| 23 Jan 2008 14:42:51 |
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| Here, here. Have these people got any brains ? It really makes one wonder !!!:msn_confu |
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Allan
Posts:11
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| 27 Jan 2008 09:26:14 |
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| Any road planners that put pedestrian crossings on every leg of every major roundabout in their city will have absoluely no qualms about siting one on a bend.:msn_mad: |
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IanC
Posts:119
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| 06 Feb 2008 13:05:06 |
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| I checked with ACC and got the following reply:
[quote]When designing a traffic calming measure such as a pedestrian refuge Island, a PV2 survey is carried out (this determines where pedestrians regularly cross the road) which denotes where the desire line is and where the Island will go. However, the Island was installed primarily to slow down traffic as well as provide a crossing facility for pedestrians.
The speed limit on Kingswells Crescent is 30mph and The Highway Code states that with any type of traffic calming measure drivers must - 'Maintain a reduced speed along the whole of the stretch of road within the calming measures.' The Highway Code also states that the typical stopping distance while travelling at 30mph is 23m.
Likewise, pedestrians crossing a pedestrian refuge Island should only cross the road when it safe to do so, i.e when there is no traffic approaching. The Island is designed to allow pedestrians to cross the road in 2 stages and thereby allow pedestrians to safely wait on the Island until there is a safe time to cross the road. Unlike a controlled crossing pedestrians have no priority over vehicular traffic and thus must exercise due care when crossing the road.
I have looked into the issues you have raised and have visited the site, both sides of the road become visible to eastbound drivers at approximately 75m from the Traffic Island, likewise for westbound drivers visibility becomes clear at approximately 105m. The desired minimum distance with regard to visibility when a driver is approaching an Island, whilst travelling at a 85th%tile speed of 30mph, is 65m. This distance can be reduced to an absolute minimum of 50m. For you information the 85th%tile speed is the speed at which 85% of the total volume of traffic is travelling at or below. The above information relates to guidance published by the Department of Transport.
Whilst on site I noticed the vegetation has started to encroach on to the footway so as a matter of course I will ensure that it is cut back.
I hope this answers all of your queries but should you require any further information then please do not hesitate to contact me.
I have attached the drawing for the proposed traffic Island on Kingswells Crescent for your information. From the previous public consultation we have listened to the residents concerns regarding the location of the bus stop so it has been moved accordingly. Due to financial constraints the proposed traffic Island has been dropped from this years works programme, It is envisaged that the proposed works will be implemented in the new financial year subject to funding. If you have any problems opening this file please let me know.[/quote]
So it looks like the crossing is safe if cars are travelling at or below 30 mph.
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andy92
Posts:48
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| 07 Feb 2008 16:07:17 |
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| Ian,
Can you confirm when a speed survey was carried out at the site.
I agree with what you have stated, however all the above depends on drivers sticking to the speed limit. |
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andy92
Posts:48
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| 07 Feb 2008 16:08:49 |
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| Sorry, forgot to ask, can you confirm what the 85th%tile speed was for the site.
Thanks |
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IanC
Posts:119
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| 08 Feb 2008 08:32:33 |
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| Andy,
I am not aware of any recent speed checks. The design of the road layout appears to be based on a 85th percentile speed of 30mph, which is the desired design speed. This is a theoretical speed, not the measured speed. If the calming is effective then this will be the actual speed.
Have you seen anyone speeding through this section of road coming downhill? What do you think their speed was?
An important issue is that the pedestrian does not have right of way, and should be looking for traffic. Assuming that the pedestrian walks at 2mph they would have enough time to cross from the island to the other side if the car was travelling at less than 46 mph. For 1.5mph the max safe speed of a car would be 35mph (my figures). This assumes that if they were crossing from the road side to the island and they saw a car coming they would wait at the island until the car passed.
Do you think a sign showing the crossing around the bend would be an advantage?
Ian |
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andy92
Posts:48
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| 08 Feb 2008 17:02:13 |
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| Ian,
I believe an 85th%tile can only be worked out after a speed survey has been carried out at a specific site.
I have seen numerous cars speeding both up and down hill. Normally when travelling from the bypass, after tuurning into the road, the car in front disappears into the distance. 46mph is a reasonable speed, I have seen cars that in my opinion were travelling faster than that.
Appreciate that a pedestrian does not have a right of way and going back my first post, there are many factors which have to be taken into account, i.e. reaction time of driver and speed they are travelling and also pedestrian awareness.
My only concern is that the island would have been better placed so it afforded both drivers and pedestrians better views and with that, more time to react.
I think a warning sign is a good idea. Signs when used properly, are an advantage. The other extreme is the stretch of road between Kingswells roundabout and Westhill. Try counting the number and the relevence the next time you are on the road and you will see what I mean.
I do appreciate the work that goes into making Kingswells a safe place to reside, hope you dont think I was having a go, just giving my opinion.
Thanks
Andy |
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IanC
Posts:119
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| 08 Feb 2008 19:59:40 |
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| Andy,
Just to clarify: are you saying that cars are still travelling at 46mph with the island in place?
If so can you come along to the KCC meeting on Monday @ 8pm @ Community Centre where this can be discussed further.
Ian |
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| You are not authorized to post a reply. |
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